Meg Stalter Commits to the Bit
When the play “Oh, Mary!” opened on Broadway, in the summer of 2024, it was in no way guaranteed to be a hit. A kooky comic farce that originally débuted downtown, at the Lucille Lortel Theatre, the show had an outlandish premise: What if Mary Todd Lincoln was a delusional drunk who wanted more than anything to sing cabaret, much to the dismay of her President husband, who just so happened to be secretly gay? Its director, Sam Pinkleton, had never before helmed a Broadway production, and its writer and star, Cole Escola, would also be making their Broadway début. As it turns out, midtown was aching for an infusion of fresh talent, and “Oh, Mary!” quickly became a runaway sensation. The show is still selling out the Lyceum Theatre two years later—and remained a hit even after the departure of the Tony-winning Escola, who left the New York production in 2025 to pursue other opportunities. Escola, Pinkleton, and the “Oh, Mary!” team came up with a brilliant scheme for keeping audiences invested: what if they brought in consummate character actors to play Mary in short, highly publicized stints? Those who have stepped into Mary’s hoopskirt so far include Jane Krakowski, Maya Rudolph, Betty Gilpin, Jinkx Monsoon, Hannah Solow, John Cameron Mitchell, and Titus Burgess. In September, Bowen Yang will take over the role. But for the past two months the part of Mary has belonged to Megan Stalter, the thirty-five-year-old actress, singer, and comedian who first broke out via the HBO Max sitcom “Hacks,” in which she played a boisterous, entitled Hollywood agent named Kayla and stole nearly every scene she was in.
I recently went to see Stalter in “Oh, Mary!” and found myself laughing so hard that I audibly snorted; her physical choices, from cantilevering her body off a tall desk to stomping around like an overtired toddler, are inspired. Even aside from her bravura turn on Broadway, Stalter is having quite the year. “Hacks,” which was created by Paul W. Downs, Lucia Aniello, and Jen Statsky, closed out its fifth and final season this spring as one of the most lauded comedies of its era. Over the course of the series, Stalter’s character transformed from a smarmy brat into a tenderhearted go-getter; Stalter and Downs, who plays her work partner, emerged as one of the most likable duos on television. Last summer, she also starred in Lena Dunham’s Netflix comedy “Too Much.” Now she’s developing a star vehicle of her own, called “Church Girls,” which will draw on her experiences growing up both queer and Pentecostal in Ohio.
Stalter got her start in Chicago, where she performed at venues such as Second City and ImprovOlympic while working a day job as a nanny. It was there that she developed her comic persona, which often involves playing a character who is both clueless and overconfident. During the pandemic, she gained notoriety for daffy front-facing videos such as “Hi, Gay!,” in which she affected the tone of a pandering marketing executive (“We are sashaying away with deals!”). Her work often blurs the line between absurdism and reality, to the point where it can be hard to know whether or not she is doing a bit—take, for example, her upcoming pop album, “Crave,” whose first single, “The Prettiest Girl in America,” dropped in May. Is Stalter a serious musician, or a comedian dipping into a character for a gag? Does it even matter? Either way, you’re dancing (and laughing). I sat down with Stalter the other day at the theatre-district watering hole Joe Allen. She had just gotten her voice back after a bout with laryngitis that took her out of a few “Oh, Mary!” performances, and she was thrilled to be back onstage. We shared a plate of fries and discussed “Oh, Mary!,” her red-carpet-outfit stunts, her scrappy days making Cameo videos, and why she believes that God loves gays. Our conversation has been edited and condensed.
Let’s start with last night—I saw you in “Oh, Mary!” How did that show feel? Can you tell the different rhythms between performances, when it’s going well and when it is going less well?
Yes. I feel that we were amazing last night. You could feel the audience. There are definitely nights where maybe people are more . . . misbehaving. It’s not much, because people are pretty behaved when they see Broadway shows, but once in a while you’ll get someone who might say something back to you. Which isn’t really bad, but it’s more like they respond to a joke that they know they’re probably not supposed to. It’s not really a call and response.
No. It’s not “Rocky Horror.” [A waitress comes over and asks, “Anything to drink for you?”]
Can I have a Diet Coke with lime? [Stalter turns back.] Do you think that’ll make it in, that I had a Diet Coke?
Sure. Do you need to plug Diet Coke?
No, but you know how sometimes the interviews will be, like, “She came in . . .”
“She ate a Cobb salad. She was glowing from the outside!”
“She’s sweaty, and two minutes late, and she looks like she ran here.”
This is not your first time living in New York, right?
I lived in New York right before the pandemic. Before that, I’d spent, like, seven years in Chicago doing improv and standup. And then finally I got a manager here, and I was, like, “Oh, my gosh.” The plan was to move to Los Angeles, but then I was, like, “New York’s so fun, and the standup scene’s so amazing. I’ve got to try it.” At that point, I was a nanny in Chicago, so I moved without a job, but I saved up enough to get here. I was needing money. And Cole [Escola] hired me to do a podcast with them—the “National Lampoon” podcast. That was actually my first comedy job that paid enough where I didn’t have to have a day job. It was like heaven because it was so cool you got to go into an office every day. It made me feel like I was on “S.N.L.” or something.
How did you know Cole?
We became friends online. I remember just being so in love with them and their comedy and vice versa. Then we met and it felt like we knew each other forever.
How long before the pandemic did you move here?
Six or seven months. And it felt like things were picking up. I got to do shows every night if I wanted to, and I was becoming close friends with tons of comedians here. I had friends before I moved, too, like the Three Busy Debras and Cat Cohen. So I knew that when I got here I’d have a support system. I started doing Cameo videos, and then the pandemic hit. So Cameo saved me, because that’s how I made money. I did hundreds of them. I didn’t charge that much, but I had to do a lot. I was always doing it in character, and they’d be, like, five-minute-long videos because I didn’t want to charge people to have, like, a twenty-second video. It just felt so wrong. So I’d charge maybe thirty dollars for seven minutes.
I think you were charging too little! Did you always do that same character?
No, it would be custom for each person. There were a lot of weird ones, where they were going to expire, so I’d be late at night, no makeup, in the closet. The weirdest one is I did a video where they said they were getting married, and I made a joke about them cheating. And then the person was, like, “I’m never going to send this to my partner. This is awful. I would never cheat on them.” Which then made them sound like they were cheating. . . . So then I sent them one back and I was, like, “Hi, your partner’s definitely not cheating on you. No one would ever do that to you. No one’s cheating on anyone. Have a fun wedding!”
I don’t think you have to do Cameo anymore. I think you’re officially past it.
It’s fun to do, because it feels like you’re connecting with people who follow you, but it’s a lot. I feel very lucky that I was able to do it in a way that still felt like me, because I wasn’t famous.
How long did you stay in New York?
Once the pandemic hit, I packed up and moved back in with my family in Ohio. It was so comforting and weird. It felt like a scary sleepover.
Let’s jump back. You were born in Cleveland, your mother’s a nurse, and your dad’s a tattoo artist?
Yep. He owns a tattoo place called Voodoo Monkey Tattoo.
Has he tattooed you?
He has. And my brother works there now, and he tattooed me also.
So your brother’s a tattoo nepo?
Yeah. They’re both amazing artists. They’re incredible. My dad did this. [She lifts up her pant leg.] It’s a rabbit. This one on my upper thigh says “Baby, I’m a star.” And then right here, there’s a bee body with a wolf head that my sister also has. My brother did my star, but my dad did everything else. They’re so talented. My dad has a weird sense of humor and taste. I feel like he introduced us to stuff—like, trusted us to watch weird stuff when we were little. There’s this video store in Cleveland with all these obscure movies—there’d be Pee-wee Herman and Divine stuff. I just remember seeing these covers and being, like, “That is the coolest woman I’ve ever seen.”
When you were little, did you feel funny? Did you make people laugh?
I loved to laugh. As kids, we would make videos, and fake commercials, and put on talk shows for each other, and we’d film them. I think I remember feeling funny when I was in middle school, and I found a group of friends, even though I had a really hard time in middle school.
Bullied?
Bullied. I think what happened was, I came from a Catholic elementary school, even though I’m not Catholic, and then went to public school for middle school, and I had no idea about the politics, where there’s nerds and there’s popular kids. I was extremely shy in class, because it was such a culture shock. I was a cheerleader in maybe eighth grade, but then the cheerleaders didn’t like me. I think I saw “Bring It On” and I just wanted to be a cheerleader. I didn’t want my mom to know how bad people were being to me. I remember at cheer camp, she gave me a disposable camera, and I would take pictures, but no one’s looking at the camera. I remember her being, like, “Uh, you’re not really in a lot of these pictures.” But the friends I did have, I would make them laugh. And then in high school I found that everyone in the drama club liked me, even though I didn’t really get a good part. In drama club, I was thriving. I had a gay boyfriend. We were a power couple.
Did you go to the prom together?
We did, and then we broke up maybe a week later.
Was he getting the big parts?
No. We were, like, the goofball clowns. Our best roles, though, were when I was Helen Keller’s mom and he was her brother in “The Miracle Worker.” We couldn’t stop laughing during rehearsal. We loved each other. But we only kissed with our mouths closed.
Well, you were a good Christian girl.
Yeah. And I was, like, “Who cares? He’s gay.”
How religious were you back then growing up?
I grew up in a Pentecostal church. And then in high school, kind of toward the end, I got really involved with my youth group at my church, which was a nondenominational church. I feel just as close to God now as I did then, and probably even closer, because I feel like I know myself more. I was always spiritual in church, but then in high school I felt like I got to know God in a really tangible way.
Did you have visions? Did God speak to you?
Well, in the church, the nondenominational one, we had really spiritual experiences in worship. We spoke in tongues, which wasn’t scary to me because I grew up around that. After high school, I remember really wanting to go on this mission trip, called Youth with a Mission. I told my mom, “I am going on a six-month program in Peru,” and she started crying because she didn’t want me to go. I was twenty-one, but I felt so much younger.
I do feel now I would love to find a church that lines up with things that I believe in. I know there are definitely a lot of gay-affirming churches. I never felt at all judged by God about being a queer person, ever.
Was the rest of your family into the church as well?
I was kind of the one dragging us. I was the one getting my siblings to go on a Wednesday night. Like, “Get in the car, let’s go.” But they never protested. I watched my siblings fall in love with God in a different way. They also went on mission trips. I think mission trips are very tricky, looking back, because I’m sure that there’s a lot of churches that do really help. But it’s, like, O.K., do they really need us to be there? Some churches do great work, and raise money, and they can really be a blessing to others. But then I think other times you take a big group of teen-agers to the Amazon River and then you’re kind of just hanging out there. If it’s just about seeing the world, and meeting different people that grew up different from you, that’s cool. But to think you’re going to go and be a savior, that’s dangerous.
You came back from Peru and thought you might be a nurse, correct?
Well, after high school, I just wanted to be an actor, but I didn’t have the money to go audition and live in L.A. So I guess in my mind I thought if I’m going to pay for school, I want to pay for something that I can help people with, and where I will be guaranteed to have a job. I knew I was going to community college, which is amazing and an affordable way to go to school. But it just didn’t go well because I just really wanted to perform. I feel like that was God, because I had no money, and I still felt drawn to performing. I remember being in the car with my mom and I was, like, “So what do you think I’m going to do after school?” And she was, like, “I think you’re going to be a teacher or a nurse,” because that’s what I was in classes for. And I was, like, “You don’t think I’m going to be an actor?” And she’s, like, “What are you talking about? I didn’t know if you still wanted to do that, because you’re not in school for that.” I was devastated. But she encouraged me to take an improv class in Dayton, and I did. And that led to me being, like, “O.K., I’m going to move to Chicago.” And, honestly, my mom encouraged me to move, too. I think God used my mom to encourage me, because I was very attached to her opinion.
So you dropped out of nursing school, and moved to Chicago. Was it to be closer to the improv world, or to Second City?
There were some friends of mine from improv class that moved to Chicago, but I didn’t realize it was such a huge place for comedy. I was just so desperate to perform. When I moved, I was, like, “I’m going to jump right in. I’m taking improv. I’m doing standup. I’m nannying during the day, and at night I’m going to go perform and learn how to do it.” And then I spent years doing that. I took classes at Second City, ImprovOlympic, the Annoyance. I performed at the Hideout a lot. I was in Chicago when Sarah Sherman was there, so we met during a standup show and then we became really close friends.
When did you develop your kind of particular comedic language? You have a knack for playing characters, and I wonder when that developed.
There was this weekly all-women comedy show called “Hoo-Ha Comedy,” and I was an intern on the show, and then became a producer. Sometimes they’d let us do a couple minutes of standup, and I remember doing a slide-show presentation instead of standup, and I think that opened the door for me to be, like, “Oh, I could do whatever I want. I don’t have to set up a punch line.” But that was after two years of trying to do it the way everyone else was doing it. At first, I thought if I wanted to do a character, like a drunk mom, I’d have to think of a setup, like, “Oh, this mom is at Chuck E. Cheese, drinking.” It wasn’t really working. But I always thought I was really funny. I actually was always pretty confident that I should be onstage in a delusional way.
Almost every great performer is at some point in their life delusional.
I mean, in middle school, I was so bullied, like, outwardly, every day. And yet I still chose to sing an Avril Lavigne song in the school’s talent show, and I wasn’t even a good singer. I had barely anyone on my side, and yet I’m still singing. It’s just bizarre. There’s something in me that had to do it. I knew people would be mean, and still wanting to perform in front of them is psychotic. But I was, like, “I just can’t miss this chance.”
Well, you sang great last night.
I can sing as a character. And I’m a pop star now, so I don’t get nervous to sing my own music, of course.
Did you think you were destined to be famous?
I always thought that it would happen. In my brain as a kid I would picture my life as a TV show.
You felt like the main character and then you became one. It’s like the law of attraction.
I did pray every day that that girl who was mean to me would leave the school, and she got expelled. So I don’t know . . .
At what point did you start to develop your persona? It’s so specific.
I felt like two years into Chicago I started trying weird stuff out. I would go through stages. There was a stage where every set I wanted to do a surprising bit, and usually it was some sort of burlesque. I would be in a bra putting whipped cream all over myself. I don’t even remember what the joke was. And it would smell so bad. It spoils so fast. And then I’d have one bit where I had fake blood in my mouth. I’d come out onstage and I’d start talking and then it would come out of my mouth and people would be laughing, sometimes in shock. And I’d be, like, “Oh, sorry. My teeth are bleeding. That just means I’m nervous.” I started experimenting, where the experience is “Is she kidding?”
I think people still wonder that about you all the time. Like, with the pop-star thing . . .
Yes.
How serious is that, and how much of it is a bit?
I mean, the music is a way for me to tell my story.
About being the prettiest girl in America.
Yeah, it’s real. I think every comedian wants to be a musician. And musicians want to be comedians. Anyways, I just feel like I make a really good pop star and I have a really beautiful voice.
See, I still can’t tell if this is a bit. How did you actually write those songs? Who wrote them with you?
I wrote them with Jesse Thomas, who is an amazing, legit, really talented songwriter. I found them through Cailin Russo, who had this song called “Triple It.” It’s not a joke song, but there is just something cool and hot and funny about it. She’s singing about making more money than this guy. She’s, like, “I’m going to make more money than you. I’m going to buy your house and then sell it for triple the price.” I thought whoever wrote this with her could help me. They would get it. Jesse’s been really amazing. And I sound amazing on the album.
Are you dropping another single soon?
Yeah, it’s called “Little Black Dress.” It’s a huge hit with children. My nephew loves it. It’s all about how I always want to wear this black dress and my friends are, like, “Please don’t wear it tonight.” They’re jealous. I wear it too much.
Are you really going to go on a full, countrywide tour?
We don’t have dates yet, but yes. And I can’t wait to work on the second album. I’m already thinking of ideas.
But you can understand how people might think this is a joke . . .
Of course. People aren’t used to you being able to sing and be funny all at once. I think I’m going to sing for, like, fifty more years. I think I’ll do a more stripped-down album for sure.
Your “Joanne.”
Yes, and I’ll film a documentary about that. And then I think I’ll probably do a Christmas album. I’ve always wanted to do a Fourth of July album also.
Maybe you need to do a Christian album.
And I feel like since I am a gay Christian, all of my music really is that. But I want to do a whole album of every genre. Remember that scatting video of Kim Cattrall? I’d love to do a whole album like that. But you don’t think of me as a “comedy singer,” though, right? Because, I mean, I am literally making legit pop music. You got to put into the interview that we got in a huge fight about the album.
Where I’m, like, “Come on, it’s just a bit.”
And I go “It’s not a joke!!!” and I throw a Diet Coke at the wall. And then I leave and I come back.
Yeah, that all definitely just happened.
By the way, do you think a drink should work with me? I think that pop stars always have some sort of soda sponsor.
Which soda would be the dream?
Ginger ale. Because I feel like Addison has Diet Pepsi and Britney has Diet Coke.
Not enough people are thinking about ginger ale.
No, they’re really not, unless they’re on a damn airplane. I don’t even want to tell you what I’ve been drinking at night. . . . Diet ginger ale with cherry juice.
That sounds really good, actually. Like a Shirley Temple but a little fucked up.
Yes. Exactly. I heard cherry juice is supposed to help you sleep.
Do you feel like you have to do something different to have the stamina to do all these shows? Broadway is brutal.
It’s hard, because I want to stay up late, because I’m kind of awake from the show. I’m trying to get on a better sleep schedule, because it’s nice to wake up and have a full day. I realize I can’t do as much during the day as I can normally. Especially on two-show days, you can’t really do anything.
You lost your voice for a little bit, yeah?
Yeah. But people have been liking the raspy voice. I’ve been drinking a lot of tea, and I also feel like I have to be really particular about when I eat, because I want to have enough energy to do the show, but I don’t want to eat a huge dinner before the show because . . .
You don’t want to throw up while you’re throwing yourself around on a desk.
Can you imagine?
I can imagine, but I don’t want to.
Live theatre’s so crazy, because you’re, like, “What if I just passed out or threw up?” Also, yesterday I hurt my hand so badly. [Stalter shows me a bruised finger.] I have a theory that the wire in my hoopskirt snapped up when I hit the desk. All I know is it happened in the first scene, because when I went backstage I was, like, “Oh, my gosh, ow.”
I want to talk about “Oh, Mary!” It feels like at this point everyone iconic gets to play this role. It’s the greatest thing to step into for a few months.
I already knew I loved the play, because I love Cole, but I didn’t get to see Cole do it. I saw Jinkx Monsoon do it, and I fell in love with her. Afterward, I went backstage and met Jinkx, and she was, like, “Would you ever do it?” I’m, like, “I’d really want to!” I told my team that I wanted to do it after “Hacks.” And then I auditioned for it.
You auditioned? Cole didn’t just call you and was, like, “You’re the next Mary”? I have this idea that Cole calls everyone individually and they are, like, “You won the lottery today, Jane Krakowski. Come on down!”
I’m sure some people don’t audition. I think I probably auditioned because I’ve never done Broadway before, and they probably wanted to make sure I could sing without passing out. I was so happy to audition, and I worked really hard on it. I just did nothing but the scenes for days. It felt like a movie moment when they called. My team was with me and we were screaming and I started crying. Because it was something I really saw myself in. When I saw Jinkx do it, I was, like, “I don’t think I’ve ever seen a character that represented me this much.” Which is so weird, because she’s a nut. She drinks, and I don’t even drink. But seeing someone that wants to perform that badly in their body, feeling stuck and not being able to. I mean, it kind of felt like that for me during the pandemic.
Yeah, let’s go back to your videos. The front-facing videos during the pandemic were how I first knew of you, and how I think so many people first came to know you.
I was terrified about not being able to perform. And what saved me is being able to do it online. I did Instagram Live every night. It was what made me not fall into the deepest depression.
Did you feel that there was something akin to a school of people coalescing back then, who were all doing these front-facing videos? There was you, Caleb Hearon, Eva Victor . . .
I love all of them, and they’re my friends. It was a huge compliment to be in any group with those people. What I will say, about doing those videos and how it relates to Mary, is, like, she wants to perform so badly, but also she sees so much in herself, and no one else has seen that until the acting teacher comes along. Not to give anything away, but I think that’s why she cares for him, is that he sees her. She’s stuck, but he sees this whole world inside of her head, and that’s how I felt at times. Maybe people think she’s too much, and I definitely have had people think that about me, that I’m too loud. I think I have a very rich inner world that maybe I didn’t always know how to bring out while growing up, and now I feel like I’m completely free, which is why it’s worked out.
I feel like you feel more free than most people, which is one of the most charming things about you.
I think part of why I like to make my standup be, like, “Is she kidding? Is she not kidding?” is because I like being silly as an adult and creating experiences. Last week, we all came to the stage door dressed as nurses and doctors and pretended like people were checking into the hospital, to their doctor’s appointment, instead of signing playbills. We’d sign, but we’d be, like, “O.K., these are your medical records.” I think it makes people feel free to see an adult basically inviting you into this imaginary place.
Let’s talk about “Hacks.” How did that come about?
I met Paul [W. Downs] at a standup show at Little Joy, when I was in L.A. I was a fan of him from “Broad City,” and he saw some of my videos, and then we just really clicked. You couldn’t all be in the area where we were performing because it was such a small space, but we pushed in to watch each other’s set. He said he actually recorded my set, because he recorded his set right before mine, and accidentally just kept it recording. Then I got the audition for “Hacks” and I wanted it so bad, because Kayla also felt like someone who made so much sense to me.
The character evolved so much over time, which I thought was beautiful. Kayla started out as a punch line but became much more.
We didn’t know I’d get to do that much. I think they realized there was so much to do with Jimmy and Kayla, to be able to develop those characters and have such sentimental moments between these two wacky, funny characters.
What about the character of Kayla really resonated with you?
She feels free to say whatever she’s thinking, and she’s also super nervous and confident at the same time. She’s delusionally confident, right? I think people also maybe second-guess her, and then she ends up kind of saving the day, because she is secretly smart and talented. She’s a bit obnoxious, and will just say what she’s thinking. She is also different from me, though, because she’s a nepo baby and is extremely spoiled.
How did you and Paul develop the idea that you would do bits together on red carpets, outside of the show? Like when you’re wearing, say, the orange leather outfits modelled on the ones Timothée Chalamet and Kylie Jenner wore?
I think it happened because we loved to improv with each other. I feel like I like to do a lot of bits in general, on the red carpet or events, and the orange outfits opened up a world. Paul and I had so much fun together doing that that we were just, like, “Why wouldn’t we want to do something weird every time?” I think it’s one of those things where, if there’s an opportunity to bring my comedy, I’ll take it. If at stage door people are there waiting to meet you, why wouldn’t we do something funny like dress as nurses? They all have their cameras out. They’re all ready to meet us and laugh. It’s more fun for us. Why not?
When you’re going to go on a talk show, do you give them a sense of the character that you’re going to do? Do you work on it, or is it sort of spontaneous?
Well, when you do interviews, a lot of times there’s the pre-interview. I’ll be, like, “I’m thinking of having really long hair that goes down to my ankles and wearing my own merch. . . .”
Do you find it’s pretty easy to get people to play along?
I think sometimes people think that they do want to jump into the pool and play, and then maybe they get nervous or they didn’t realize just how weird you were going to be. Then, some people are so down to do it. It’s just a mix of people’s comfort levels. I’ve had people say, “Yeah, totally, that makes total sense,” and then when you’re doing it they’re, like, “Who’s this freak?”
I feel like you’re the kind of person that even if it’s going bad or there’s something awkward about it there’s something pleasurable for you in that.
It’s even better. It’s better if they don’t know if it’s real or not, either.
Do you see what you’re doing as more of an art project?
I like when people say that, yes. It’s fun to decide what you want to reveal to people. I think it’s cool to talk about what’s real and what’s not, but then not tell someone what all is fake. You know what I mean?
O.K., so how much of this interview has been fake?
Ha! Like, with Andy Kaufman, wouldn’t it have been cool to hear his process? But then you also want to hold something back, to keep some of the mystery. I don’t want people to think I’m actually insane, but I guess I don’t care if some people do. It’s fun for the people who do get it, and it’s fun for the people who don’t get it, because then they get to send it to their friends and be, like, “Look at this crazy bitch,” and they’ll be, like, “Ha, ha, look at how weird this person is on this interview.” Everyone’s laughing.
Everyone’s laughing. What’s next for you? Are you still developing “Church Girls”?
I’m working on that. There are no details I’m really ready to reveal, but we were making it into a show, and now we’re reworking it as a movie. We feel like it will be better told that way.
Is it that you didn’t want to do another show after “Too Much”?
No, I definitely want to do more shows. I loved making “Too Much.” I just love Lena [Dunham] so much and just think she’s so brilliant. It felt like we were making something so special, just for us. It felt almost like play sometimes. It felt really intimate, and I just feel like Lena’s such a confident director, and she moves fast and she knows what she wants to get.
What did you learn about your craft from Lena that’s different from what you learned from Paul and Jen [Statsky] and Lucia [Aniello]?
I feel like I learned from Lena to trust that she got everything that she needs. You have to trust your director. If they got it, then they got it. I think, also, I’m fortunate that all of them let me improvise, even though I’m open to doing a project where I have to stick to the script.
Let it be known.
I think I also learned from Lena how to lead a show.
What does that involve?
Well, I did work with an acting coach named Miriam, who was also the intimacy coördinator. A lot of it was working on really big pieces in the show, even before we even knew when we were shooting them. I learned from her what it’s like to really talk about the characters and their history before. With “Hacks,” I learned how a character develops over time, because there wasn’t a lot of character background in the first season. Also, Lena takes so much from her real life. There were a lot of conversations to be had about the show—even though I’m not playing her, it was more personal material. It’s not a biography, but there’s a lot of Lena in it, so you’re talking to the source.
She sent you a D.M., right? That’s how you two met?
Yeah. It was so sweet. I couldn’t believe she even knew me. I love “Girls.” It’s the best show of all time.
I know. I can watch it over and over and over again. That and “Sex and the City.” Which was why I was so happy that you dressed up recently in that outfit from the episode “La Douleur Exquise!” And I was thinking about Sarah Jessica Parker when I was watching you in “Oh, Mary!” because she is such a precise comedienne. Every single cigarette she smoked on “S.A.T.C.” she practiced. I wonder if that’s how you work.
For her, it comes off so light, but I’m just a different performer. I mean, Jean Smart, also, she knows exactly how she’s going to move in the scene. I’m not like that. But the play’s been really cool, because I think it’s been a challenge to learn how to remember exactly where you are and say exactly that thing in that place, and it’s made me a better performer to learn how to do that. Sam [Pinkleton, the director] is so amazing, and he also let me bring myself to Mary.
Right. They don’t expect you to play it the way Cole played it.
But even with the repetition of the words you’re not improvising anything. It’s all in how you move. Every time I try to find a new feeling and make it feel new to the audience. Did you feel like, when you saw it last night, that it felt new?
Yes. I did, actually. I felt like your Mary was violent and obviously wounded, but also she was this girl inside. There was an ache to it.
Sam did talk about this—that he’s noticed that I’m playing her really young. I feel like I definitely had the instinct of, She’s so childish to me. When no one’s seeing her, she feels like a child who is throwing a tantrum. She is scared of the low after a high. That’s something a lot of people can relate to. It’s really sad, thinking that she’s so scared to be that happy because then that means she’ll fall again.
A few more things. You brought up Andy Kaufman, but is there anyone that you feel is a model for you in your career?
What I want is to make stuff that I’m in for myself, weird stuff, so I admire anyone that gets to do their own thing. I mean, I just saw “Maddie’s Secret” and it’s just so good.
Wouldn’t John Early be a good Mary?
John would be the best. And Kate [Berlant].
I want them to do it in repertory.
Every comedian wants to be able to make something that’s their unique vision, and John did such an amazing job. Same with Cole, with the play. When you let someone like that do whatever they want, the possibilities are endless.
I wonder if you feel that sometimes, when you are in a room with the suits, if you feel they are pushing you into a more conventional direction. Is it hard to explain your vision to all these people that have the money?
At times they do get it or want to get it, but then, and I’m not naming names, but in general, whether it’s a production company or a commercial that hired you, they can get scared about actually letting you do your thing. They’re scared that their audience will be scared, or that it’s too weird. It’s, like, “Just trust me, because, if you let me do this weird thing, people will talk about it, whether it’s good or bad, and that’s good for you.”
It seems like you really trust yourself.
I do.
Was that hard won, over the years?
I think with comedy, no, because for some reason I’ve been delusional. Even when I wasn’t any good, I still trusted myself.
What about with coming out?
Well, I mean, I didn’t really know that I was into women, because I wasn’t dating them growing up. I had a gay boyfriend in high school. I just assumed I was straight. Then when I said yes to doing comedy, I was, like, “O.K., maybe this is how God wants me to help people, is just being myself. Let me say yes to this. Let me move to Chicago.” Then I started dating, and pretty soon I realized I was into women as well. I think I just trusted God. I was, like, “If I love God, he must want me to dedicate my life in a certain way.” I felt drawn to performing my whole life. That must be from God.
There’s something like divine providence that you’re talking about. Where do you trust that you’re going now? Obviously you have the music, you have other projects you want to do, but, if your whole thing is you’ve been able to envision where you’re going, where do you see yourself in the next few years?
That’s such a good question. This movie’s definitely going to happen, because this is the thing I’ve wanted to make the most. The story that I want to tell is very important to me, and I feel like it’s my way of telling the world that God loves gay. That you’re allowed to be gay and love God, and that it’s not fair that people have been told that if you’re gay and you grew up in church that you can’t have that anymore just because you’re gay.
So the character’s going to be grappling with being a queer Christian?
Yeah. Yeah, and with being sort of closeted and feeling the pressure of, “If I were to come out, then can I not be in church?” It definitely makes fun of church in a loving way. I just think I haven’t seen that much that shows church and God in a good light, either way.
Well, especially in our country right now. I mean, so many people are using it as cover for horrible behavior, but I actually so admire how you live your principles, when you were, like, “I’m going to get rid of TikTok because of its censorship,” or how you’ve said Jesus would abolish ICE. That’s what believing in God is about, right? It’s integrity.
That’s so nice that you’re saying that, because I feel like people are using God’s name and Christianity in a hateful way in committing crimes in his name. I think that the story that I want to tell with “Church Girls” is coming together because I grew up with certain church people who weren’t hateful. I’m sure some of them who I didn’t know as a kid had different views than I do now about gay people, but I definitely have loved people who are in the church. It’s not all bad. I also feel my relationship to God is separate from what certain churches teach. I feel a personal relationship. My real belief is that God doesn’t think that being gay is wrong. Some churches will let gay people come to church, but they do think that it’s a sin to be gay, and I truly don’t believe that.
Well, I hope you get to make the film soon. Wait—can I ask you a really girly, superficial question?
Of course.
I want to know how you came up with your eyeliner. It’s so iconic.
I just started doing it and it wasn’t very good, and I think people thought that I was doing my makeup bad for the character. [Laughs.] I guess I used to do it a little bit thicker and crazier in Chicago. I think I’m a little better at it now. I use E.L.F. liquid eyeliner. It’s fairly cheap.
Who’s going to style you for your pop-star tour?
My amazing stylist, Kat Typaldos. I’ll come to her with an idea. She’ll come to me with an idea. For L.A. Pride, I made my outfit. It was a top and bathing-suit bottoms that were covered in cotton, so I looked like a cloud princess. It’s giving Y2K futuristic pop star.
How many dancers are you going to bring on tour?
I have three amazing dancers, but also I’m getting into the dancer community. If my three dancers aren’t available, I’ll hire twelve dancers. You know what I mean? It’s either the three I know and love, or twelve brand new.
Are you off to do your pre-show ritual? What do you do before shows?
Well, today we have a harassment meeting at the theatre.
Oh, great. Are you just harassing everyone? Is it for your benefit?
They had to do it because of me. It’s mostly pranks, me hiding people’s stuff.
What are you going to wear to the Emmys? Are you and Paul planning another stunt?
[Stalter blinks innocently.] We’re . . . planning something. ♦